An interview with my wife Jill regarding her journey of listening to and learning from the voices of people of color.

The title of this episode was coined by Dr. Drew Hart and describes the practice of listening to and believing the lived experiences and stories of others even when their stories seem foreign to us.

Helpful resources:

Be the Bridge (

Netflix Documentary: 13th (

The On Ramp podcast (

Dr. Drew Hart (

The New Jim Crow (